The formation of Haritha, the women’s wing of the Muslim Students Federation (MSF), had opened a new chapter in the deeply patriarchal structure of the Indian Union Muslim League. The presence of articulate bright young women in the League forums was too apparent to ignore. But this came to an abrupt end with the IUML top brass removing the entire Haritha leadership one fine day for demanding action against their male colleagues for verbal abuse and cyberbullying. But, the fight against patriarchy is very much on, Najma Thabsheera, the former general secretary of Haritha, tells TNIE. Excerpts:
Where do you stand now? Have you been taken back?
There has been no communication from the official side of IUML as such. We are still out of Haritha. But, many leaders in the party have offered us moral support and have asked us to continue our fight.
Have you met and raised the matter with the higher-ups like Thangal or P K Kunhalikutty after your removal?
Oh yes. Many times…
IUML general secretary P M A Salam had once refused to attend a function at Perinthalmanna in which you participated...
That happened last year. But now, I have been to party functions attended by top IUML leaders, shared the space with them, and also talked to them. There is no enmity. (Laughs…)
That can be seen as a positive change...
Yes. I do think that a positive change is happening right now. As you may know, I am a block panchayat member. The leaders are not showing any hesitation in attending the events organised by the panchayat.
But has there been any change in the functioning of IUML after your revolt? You had raised many demands including the inclusion of women in the decision-making bodies of the party…
The answer to this is a bit complex. One can’t give an outright yes or no answer to this question. We believe and see that small changes are happening. Also, big claims and proclamations are being made regarding the position of women in the party. These proclamations provide some semblance of hope.
What exactly are your demands?
Our main demand is that the League should open the doors of its decision-making bodies fully to women. That women shouldn’t be just confined to something like a women’s wing.
It can be seen that clerics and others use religious texts to justify their position when it comes to women. How can women enter the public space when such texts exist? How can you reinterpret these texts to ensure that women get their due?
I don’t think religious texts are the problem. In the case of Kerala Muslim women or even in the case of all women in the state, even if there is no interference by the religious texts, their position has never been one that saw them occupying prominent places in society. How many women CMs have Kerala had?
There have been instances which highlight how religion plays a big role in hindering the empowerment of women. Isn’t that the glaring truth? For example the controversy over the Kudumbashree pledge…
Well...Yet again as I said regarding the religious texts, we can’t blindly say that religion is the main cause. Everything, right from interpretation to thoughtless comments made by some people, is the problem.
Don’t you think that issues like equal property rights for women need to be discussed for the sake of women in the community?
Islam doesn’t consider women as inferior to men. That is a wrong interpretation. They are considered as having different responsibilities. A man has more responsibilities than a woman since he has to not only take care of his family but also the deprived. A woman doesn’t have any such responsibilities. Hence, there is a difference in proportion when it comes to the division of property.
You are saying that according to Islam, woman needs to be protected by a man. This very patriarchial mindset was the one that led to your expulsion from Haritha. Don’t you think there is an internal contradiction in your position?
It is a very complex thing. If you say a woman needs to be protected, that is not correct. What I would like to say is that there is a difference in the duties of men and women, and there is dignity in that.
The hijab issue is taking the world by storm. One is happening in Iran where women are against hijab while in Karnataka, girls are raising their voices for hijab. What is your position?
Nobody should force any idea (dress code) on anyone. Even God has not given anyone that authority. So I as a woman would stand for the freedom to choose.
But that’s theoretical. But practically, hijab is not a choice, is it?
It is an essential part of religion. But nobody can say that one has to compulsorily follow the dictums. For instance, if you go to Kannur and ask the girls studying in various colleges and wearing purdah, you will get the answer. They wear the purdah just because they find it comfortable. My mother is a teacher. She had always been wearing sari to school. However, once she happened to wear purdah and found it very comfortable. Now she wears only purdah.
But don’t you think that purdah is essentially anti-woman? It is there because women are seen as sex objects...
That might have been the case in the past. But in the case of the present generation, purdah is a choice. No one wears it out of compulsion.
Do you support the niqab? Have you worn it?
That, again, is a personal choice. But I don’t believe in it and have not worn it at any time.
If one is to point out one of the most crucial things that has happened in Kerala society in the past few decades, it is the way Muslim girls have taken to education. They are entering in large numbers in top-notch colleges. Have there been any changes in the community as a result?
Yes. A lot of changes have happened in the community. In the past, those in authority could take any decision without discussing it with anyone. However, girls have a say now. They have an opinion. They speak up and question various decisions. They are beyond all these backward-looking statements made by certain people in the community.
How about boys?
The case of boys is a matter of worry. They are superficial but girls are more mature and delve deeper before arriving at a decision.
Haleema Beevi, the first Muslim woman journalist and newspaper owner, had quit IUML and joined Congress as the former sidelined her. Something similar is happening in your case too?
Congress has different priorities. Our priority is the politics of the minority. As long as our priority remains the same, we will continue in League.
We asked this question because many CPM and Congress leaders had welcomed you to their parties after you were expelled...
We all have a definite idea of where we should stand. We all believe in the ideology of the Muslim League.
What is the ideology of the Muslim League?
Honourable existence is the political ideology of the League. Many recently accused the League in the name of patriotism. They should read the party constitution. The preamble of the party’s constitution says that we should raise ourselves as people who live in accordance with the Constitution of India.
You said that the politics of the Muslim League is the politics of minorities. There are also several other minorities such as language minorities and sexual minorities. What’s the stand of the League on sexual minorities?
The politics of the League is to treat minorities of all kinds as human beings and to uphold their dignity.
Your stance on the uniform dress code for schoolchildren is the same as that of the Muslim League. Why is an educated and empowered person like you opposed to that policy?
See, I only say a change is required in the definition of gender equality. It cannot be said that being equal in attire means that they are equal in all matters. It is superficial.
An Islamic scholar has described you as a ‘hijab-wearing rebel’. That means you are neither religious nor progressive. In other words, you should accept the patriarchy or be rejected. How do you intend to address it?
We are in the middle of it. The religious scholars who make grand statements are not aware of our experiences. I also don’t consider faith and progressive ideas as binaries.
Whenever a progressive idea is put forward – whether it is the issue of gender equality or equal property rights – we see that IUML and other Muslim religious bodies oppose them vehemently. No other community seems to have any such issue. Don’t you think these kinds of acts will isolate the community as a whole?
Yes. These are unnecessary discussions and we, the women in the community, have to bear the brunt. Religious leaders often air unnecessary statements. They don’t represent the aspirations of the women in the community. We are being unnecessarily judged. One can be religious and progressive at the same time.
That means you are saying the thought of ‘Islamic feminism’ is possible, isn’t it?
Yes, I think it is possible.
As a Muslim League sympathiser, what’s your view on the political future of IUML? Are you concerned about it?
I am actually not concerned. My focus is on the inner politics of the League. Our biggest worry is the patriarchal mindset. Everything else is secondary.
Are you optimistic that your voice would be heard by the League leadership?
We are optimistic that they will give ear to our voice. Ours is not a revolution or a fight against Muslim League. I believe in reformation. It’s a slow process, but it would bring in a sustainable change. It may not happen today or tomorrow, but League leadership will have to listen to our voices one day.
When will we get to see a woman MLA from IUML?
Soon (chuckles).