Prof TJ Joseph, the first victim of Popular Front of India’s atrocities, was in the TNIE office on the day the Union government imposed a ban on the extremist outfit. That was a strange coincidence. Any other person would have been exalted at the news of the ban of an organisation whose members chopped off his right hand. Not Professor Joseph. He says he has forgiven those who attacked him long back. Professor Joseph talks to TNIE about his life, PFI and the people who stood by him and abandoned him at the time of his biggest crisis
It’s been over 12 years since the attack. It was an incident that hurt the collective psyche of Kerala deeply. Now when you look back, what do you feel about it?
A radical organisation like PFI should not have come into existence in a state like Kerala which boasts 100% literacy and progressive thoughts. But unfortunately, they came into being and I became a victim of their radical activities. I am also deeply saddened at the death of those killed by the same organisation, especially the murder of Abhimanyu. Now with the Centre banning the PFI, I don’t know whether I am happy or not. I prefer to remain silent on it… Abhimanyu cannot know about the ban or the action taken against the PFI leaders. My heart goes to all those victims of the PFI’s violence.
You never filed a case against them… What made you forgive the attackers?
Yes, I have forgiven them long back. Because they were just tools at the hands of some others. When the attackers pounced on me and hacked me, they were just acting as per the orders of their masters. I don’t have any grudge towards an axe or sword as it is just an object. Similarly, the attackers were also objects at the hands of a few masterminds. I empathise with those leaders who ordered the attack on me blindly following a belief. I don’t have animosity towards them because they were trapped in a web of faith and were resorting to violence for their belief. Instead of banning them, we should involve them in our conversations and teach them people are all equal and we can live in this world peacefully without following any beliefs. Radicals and terrorists across the world are all prey to some sort of blind faith.
Have you ever thought that the authorities concerned failed to take the attack on you with due seriousness? Had it been taken seriously, further killings of people like Abhimanyu could have been avoided…
The terror nature of the PFI came out in the open with their attack on me. But the authorities concerned didn’t give it due seriousness though they probed it. The incident was interpreted by many saying what they did to Joseph was wrong and what Joseph did was also wrong. Maybe this kind of opinion by the authorities concerned at that time resulted in this situation.
Do you think the attack on you and the murder of Abhimanyu were a message by the PFI? Was it a symbolic move to silence their critics through fear?
Their motive was to instil fear in the minds of the people. And yes, they have succeeded in it... People still fear them. I will give you an example…When a group of my well-wishers in Muvattupuzha decided to felicitate me for winning the Sahitya Akademi award for my autobiography, they didn’t get a single auditorium to organise the function. They told me that the auditorium owners weren’t ready to give their premises for the function because they didn’t want any trouble from PFI. Such is the fear…
In your autobiography, you have said: “I was not afraid to die. My only worry is that if they kill me, I will not be there to see how the people of Kerala react to an innocent man’s death.”
Yes… I wanted to see how literate people and socio-cultural leaders of Kerala react to it. But I must say that not many socio-cultural leaders in Kerala reacted to my attack the way they should have.
But now we see a lot of people supporting you. Do you think the perception of many has changed now?
Common people’s perceptions have changed and they are supporting me. But prominent writers in Kerala haven’t supported me so far. I think the culturally and socially progressive society of Kerala has been in a deep slumber for the past 10 to 20 years. Writers, artists and social leaders aren’t showing the courage to react to social evils because they wanted to safeguard their interests. Maybe that’s the main reason why there is a lot of intolerance in Kerala.
You were attacked when the government led by LDF, which is considered progressive, was in power. Do you think you got the support you deserved?
Before the attack, I approached the office of Muvattupuzha DySP and lodged a complaint stating that a few people were trying to kill me and I needed protection. But they didn’t consider my complaint. Instead, they took a case against me for hurting the religious sentiments of a particular community. They should have at least looked into the allegations against me before registering the case. I was a college professor and none had filed a complaint against me for the question paper prepared by me. The then district collector directed the police to register a complaint seeing a group of fanatics protesting on the streets. Before proceeding against me, they should have at least taken the opinion of an expert in the subject or formed a committee of subject experts to look into the allegations of blasphemy.
The then Education Minister MA Baby had openly criticised you in the assembly... Such a reaction from Baby was unexpected.
It’s only hearsay for me. He may have reacted without knowing the facts. But as a minister, he should not have reacted without studying the facts. He is my friend now and we interact. It was during his tenure as education minister that the education department introduced a book “Mathamillatha Jeevan” in the syllabus and orthodox people protested against it and the government was forced to withdraw it. I would say that the book was the most relevant for the time. The LDF government should not have withdrawn the book succumbing to the pressure of religious organisations. If the government had gone ahead, Kerala would now be a more progressive and refined state.
What was the stand of Congress and UDF on the issue then?
All political parties including Congress condemned the attack then. Even the PFI leaders condemned the attack though they planned and executed it. Leaders of all political parties visited me at the hospital at that time except the leaders of the Muslim League. I have heard that when the college dismissed me from service, a few Congress and Muslim League leaders openly supported the college’s decision.
Do you think the stand taken by the college management against you played a role in the PFI attack on you?
The Church leaders take a decision only if it is beneficial to them. I didn’t mind their stand at that time but their decision to dismiss me from service at a later stage really hurt me. They took such a decision after I was attacked. The then bishop even issued a pastoral letter to be read in all churches explaining the circumstances that necessitated my dismissal. They also attached a letter from the college manager along with the pastoral letter detailing the timeline of the events and the action taken against me. If the college management had taken a firm stand in supporting me, the protests at the time would have ended and they may not have attacked me.
At any point later did the Church approach you and express regret?
I don’t think the Church will ever regret its decisions. In 2014, after the death of my wife and considering the public sentiments growing against them, they decided to reinstate me in service. They were forced to take me back only when a few senior lawyers advised them on the possibility of facing legal action for the abetment of suicide. Though they reinstated me, they purposefully isolated me. They also made sure that I didn’t interact with any of my colleagues and students. They officially reinstated me on a Friday, two days prior to my retirement date. They chose Friday purposefully so that the next two days the college was closed. Even after reinstating me in service, the Church issued another pastoral letter stating that I am still at fault and the decision to reinstate me was taken on humanitarian grounds.
So you never received any support from Church and the community?
I didn’t receive any support from the Church leaders but I had the support of the community members. There were a lot of priests who empathised with me and supported me. I am alive now because of the support and care of my community members.
Do you still go to church? Do you still have faith?
No. I have stopped going to church. I was a believer. But I have decided to dissociate myself from religion. The need of the hour today is to give a world which has no religion. I am now free from the constraints of religion. I know that after death I will not go to heaven (chuckles). It will be to someplace where I had been before my birth. I believe that today we need to swim against the current. I believe that the era of religion is over. What is needed is to wipe out religion completely and herald in an era steeped in scientific awareness and humanity.
So you are ready to be buried in “themmadikuzhi…”
(Laughs…) There are many options like the municipal electric crematorium at Muvattupuzha or the medical college or I can be buried on my property. I have directed my children to not bury me in the church cemetery. To see that my wish is carried out, I am also planning to draw up a will regarding that. (chuckles)
You were a very popular professor among the students. After the incident how was their response?
Students, especially the boys, visited me when I was in jail and also at the hospital after the attack. They brought me home-cooked food when I was at the hospital. The students even visited me at my home. In the case of girls, even though they wanted to visit me, they couldn’t, fearing a backlash from the public. But the fact that these girl students were very much affected by the attack came to light when I happened to come across a former student of mine when I was travelling to Marayur. The girl student was with her family and when she introduced me to her daughter, the child said, “So this is the teacher for whom you cried out aloud when you heard how he lost his hand.” I was touched…
The passage you had chosen was from a book by P T Kunhumuhammed which was part of the references suggested by the university. What was the context for choosing that passage? We are asking because many people still wonder why that particular passage was chosen…
It was a passage that was imprinted in my memory. I used to say the dialogue in the passage at my home also. Since the usage of the language was one associated with Muslims, the name of the character had to be one from that community. The character keeps on asking God the same question again and again even after it has been explained clearly by the Almighty. That is the situation of modern man. In Waiting for Godot, Samuel Beckett portrays the helplessness of the modern man who waits for the salvation that religion promises, but which never comes. These dialogues touched me like the play by Samuel Beckett and prompted me to use them in the question paper.
Do you regret that decision?
No. There is no use thinking that things would have been different had I not used that passage. We are doing our work. I do what I like to do. But if I do something or say something that hurts someone’s feelings then I make sure to apologise. I do everything thinking that I am doing something good. It was the same belief I had when I decided to use the passage. As a person who set the question paper, I consider my decision to include the passage a very correct one. The question was very appropriate.
Was there any move by the BJP to lure you? You attended some programmes organised by BJP and Sangh outfits...
BJP had always extended a helping hand. The Yuktivadi organisation too had come forward. I have never refused their help. But they have not approached me promising me a membership. However, they have told me that if I agree they would give me a ticket to contest the elections. But I refused it.
What’s your take on ‘Love Jihad’ and ‘Narcotic Jihad’ controversies?
I feel that people should be able to tie the knot with whom they love irrespective of religion and caste. During my college studies, I dreamt of an intercaste marriage after finding a partner from another religion. However, I could not find such a person and nobody approached me with affection. So I had to go for an arranged marriage. But, I do not agree with the act of luring young girls in the guise of love and spoiling their lives. It’s a crime.
Your autobiography named ‘Attupokatha Ormakal’ (Memories that were not chopped off) received the Sahitya Akademi award…
It has received a good response from the readers. Many still call me after reading the book. I am touched.
Have you ever met the persons who attacked you?
Yes, during the identification parade in jail and at the court. I identified them in court also. During the identification parade, I touched them and pointed out who did what during the attack.
Has any of them approached you with an apology?
No. I don’t think they were apologetic because they carried out the attack because of their religious beliefs.
Who hurt you the most? Those who attacked you or the Church-run college management which backstabbed you?
The college management. No doubt.
How the hand chopping incident changed TJ Joseph personally?
I try to look at the incident in a positive way now. I always wanted to be a writer but was too lazy to write. Sometimes I think that the chopping off of my hand is a punishment for not writing though nature gifted me a hand to write. I became a writer because of the incident and received the Sahitya Akademi Award - a prestigious honour that every writer aspires to. Also, when I was young, I wanted to lead a socially committed life. But, I also got drawn into the typical middle-class life. The incident has turned me into a socially committed person.
The ban on Popular Front has triggered a debate and some people have demanded a similar ban on RSS. The argument is that PFI and RSS are two sides of the same coin. How do you see it?
I don’t believe so. Both are totally different.
Have you noticed the term ‘Chrisanghi’… A section of the Christian community has been into aggressive posturing recently…
Extremism should not be used as a tool to counter extremism. This is not good for humanity. All religions are growing more intolerant. People live in amity in Scandinavian countries where there is no religion. A secular country like India should bring in a law banning the inculcation of religious principles among youngsters before the age of 18.