Former Delhi chief minister Sheila Dikshit talks to The New Indian Express Editorial Director Prabhu Chawla on TV channel National Voice, about the future of the Congress and Rahul Gandhi’s chance of winning the 2019 elections as the party chief. Excerpts:
Nowadays, the Congress is not in a stable position. What do you think?
It is true. But nothing is constant. Ups and downs are common in politics.
The party is in trouble since 2012. You have lost almost all the elections.
You can take the example of others; the BJP was in trouble for several years. But it does not mean that the people will forget the Congress. Today whatever development you see is only due to the hard work of the party.
People say that the Congress has tarnished the country’s image, and there are several charges against the party, including corruption from which you have not been able to come out.
Not exactly. I agree that there are some charges, but has anyone been sent to jail? It was not required. In our democracy, we face several allegations which are not right and also there are appreciations which are not good either.
Since the Independence till 2016, we have never seen the Congress in such a troubled state. It used to be the number one party in the Rajya Sabha. It appears that the future of the party is at stake.
No, I don’t agree. When Indiraji lost the elections, she once again organised polls in all the states. But still the Congress had lost everywhere. Even after that, the party once again came back to power.
The BJP’s dream of “Congress-mukt Bharat” will be fulfilled or not?
No, such dream will never be fulfilled. Sometimes we get more seats, sometimes we get fewer seats, sometimes we form the government and sometimes we are in the Opposition. It is up to our voters who keep on changing their taste. This time they have shifted their views.
You won the elections in 2004 and 2009. But in 2014, the Congress was decimated. What can be the biggest reason behind such defeat? Was it corruption?
No, I think the voters felt that the government should be changed as it was in power for 10 years. On the other hand, Modi sahab had already showed an alternative. He is a good speaker but how much work he can do is a different issue.
When Sonia Gandhi came into the party in 1998, the number of seats came down. But in 2004, it again increased and in 2009 it was more than what Rajiv Gandhi used to have. But now it seems that she does not have that attraction.
No, I don’t agree. Sonia Gandhi still has that attraction. She is one of the most matured leaders not only in the Congress, but also in the whole country.
If so, then why didn’t she campaign much in Assam this time? It seems that she is moving out of politics and depending on someone else.
No, she is not depending on others but is busy preparing the next generation. This may take time.
If she is preparing the next generation, then what will you say about Rahul Gandhi? He had contested election in 2004. Now it is almost 12 years and he could not create any impression among the voters. Will Rahul Gandhi be able bring back the party to power?
You may think that, but we are still confident. We are truly going through a tough time but we will definitely come out of it. Hope is still there.
But I don’t see any hope in the near future.
There was a time when the BJP was completely wiped out. The party won two seats in the 1984 elections. But once again it managed to bounce back. You should wait for the next election and see how the Congress comes back to power.
What will you say about your leaders in Chhattisgarh, Assam, Kerala, Tamil Nadu and Andhra Pradesh who quit the party?
It is the habit of small people who jump from one party to another. But it doesn’t mean that the Congress is ruined. It is still in the same position. Whenever the party organises a meeting, you will still find several people attending it.
Several people came with Sanjay Gandhi and they helped him win the polls. But the story is something different in case of Rahul Gandhi. They have lost the elections despite having a background in the Congress.
You are talking about the past. There is always rejuvenation in the Congress where young and old workers develop relation with each other and they carry it forward. I have faith in them.
The BJP came back to power after getting a leader like Narendra Modi who attracted the youth. Is there anyone in the Congress?
Yes, there is Sonia Gandhi. She has always showed her interest towards progress. She has worked hard and did lots of sacrifices. Manmohan Singh’s policies too brought lots of development in the country.
But during their tenure, we have heard several cases of corruption. What will you say about it?
There is corruption in the BJP too. Prominent leaders like Vasundhara Raje and Smriti Irani are big examples. Irani is facing some problem with her degree but she is still quiet. The Congress always criticises policies but they avoid indulging in personal attacks.
We hear about misuse of language in the party. But no one discusses about the subject. What is the reason behind it?
Who started this? Let us talk about GST. Today, they say that the Congress is obstructionist. But they should be blamed for it. They had started it first. Also, it depends upon the topmost leader that what type of language he is using. It is also the responsibility of the present culture, which is quite different.
Using the term ‘topmost leader’, you are definitely referrring to the PM. But I feel something must have happened from both ends. Both parties have said something against each other.
If you say something against someone, then you should get ready to face an attack. A Prime Minister should always maintain his dignity.
Is the Prime Minister bringing down his level?
Sometimes he says such things which are not expected from a PM.
According to the Opposition, the Congress neither has any leader nor slogan.
Why don’t you wait for some time? The Central Government has just completed two years. You will know everything in the 2019 elections.
In future, Rahul Gandhi has to lead the Congress. Now what has he done in the last 10 years which would help him defeat Narendra Modi in 2019 polls?
In the last 10 years, Rahul Gandhi was not the topmost leader. I cannot say anything about the future but I have full faith in the Congress. It will definitely do well in the upcoming elections.
Do you want Rahul Gandhi to win the 2019 elections? What is your wish?
I will certainly want Rahul Gandhi to be there. He has three years to prepare himself.
You were chief minister thrice. You are also known as UP’s daughter-in-law. Why don’t you go back to the state?
I will later think about it if I get any opportunity.
The Congress does not have any strong base in UP. How will you manage to win there?
It is true that we don’t have a strong base in UP. The BJP too is also in the same position. You may get surprises from us.
In Delhi, a case has been filed against you. The BJP has blamed that you and Kejriwal have joined hands.
The BJP says anything. Let them say whatever they want to.
Do you know there are some corruption charges against you?
I am confident that there is no corruption charge against me.
What do you think Kejriwal is doing now?
It is really tough to understand what he is trying to do. He is visiting Punjab, Goa and also saying that he will go to many other places. He also made his 21 MLAs as parliamentary secretaries... it is really tough to understand his style. Now he is trying to fight with Modi.
Do you agree with Kejriwal about not passing his Bills?
Bills are only passed when they are valid.
Do you think that the Central Government is not letting them work smoothly?
No, I don’t think so.
