Neeraj Ghaywan’s second feature film, Homebound, premieres on Wednesday, May 21, in the official Un Certain Regard section at the Cannes Film festival. It marks a return to feature filmmaking for Ghaywan after a decade and also a comeback to Un Certain Regard in as many years. His debut feature Masaan played in the same section in Cannes 2015 and won the FIPRESCI critics prize and the Promising Future prize.
Homebound is backed by a mainstream Bollywood studio, Karan Johar’s Dharma Productions, and features young Bollywood stars like Ishaan Khatter, Janhvi Kapoor and Vishal Jethwa in the lead roles. Hollywood legend Martin Scorsese has boarded the film as Executive Producer.
Rooted in the real, it is based on Basharat Peer’s article “Taking Amrit Home” (online version titled “A Friendship, a Pandemic, and a Death Beside the Highway”) published in The New York Times.
Days before the Cannes premiere and the overwhelming media attention that comes with it, The New Indian Express/Cinema Express caught up with Ghaywan and Johar for a relaxed, extensive conversation.
Excerpts:
To start off, Neeraj, what took you so long to make your second feature film?
There’s this imposter syndrome. I think every filmmaker goes through that self-doubt. In my case it was accentuated a lot with my first time at Cannes with Masaan. It got triggered during the applause that I got for it. Since then I've been trying to find meaning in a meaningless world. During this time, I did make a couple of shorts like Geeli Puchhi and Juice, and worked in Made in Heaven and Sacred Games. But I was trying to find something that really speaks to me, questions me, and allows me to question others. I am moved a lot by the themes of class, gender, sexuality, intersectionality, and that has been the fulcrum of everything I do. I'm drawn more towards the stories of the subaltern, towards people who have not been heard, something that speaks on their behalf and that does not have the gaze of urban folk or a festival gaze. My quest has been for something that comes deeply from within the subaltern world.
What brought you and Karan together?
Karan and I had been trying to make one film together, which didn't take shape. It was a biopic. It didn't pan out the way we were intending it to. I'm very happy that he got on board for this film. Contrary to this popular perception about an independent filmmaker like me going to Karan Johar from the commercial world, and this questioning whether I am trying to be disruptive. No, it has genuinely come from a place of wanting to work with people that you can trust. I want to work with people who have kindness. The entire crew has to follow this basic tenet of being kind. I found it in Karan while doing Geeli Puchchi [one of the shorts in Dharmatic’s Netflix anthology Ajeeb Dastaans]. I believe that if I were to make Homebound again, I'd still make it with Karan, because he has that sensibility. He read the script multiple times, gave me everything, empowered me. Maybe our cinematic tastes are different, but, at a human level we connect. We have the same kindness, we have the same empathy towards people.
What made you come on board Karan?
He had me at Neeraj. It was literally like Neeraj is doing something, I want to produce it. I was blown away by his debut feature Masaan. I had the opportunity of seeing it right after it burst open at Cannes and met with critical acclaim and success, and I absolutely loved it. Subsequently, we met and collaborated. I was over the moon that he was part of Ajeeb Dastaans. I think he added a lot of gravitas to the ensemble of directors in the anthology. I just love his work and am a huge admirer of his talent.
I also think I tend to get generalized and slotted. No matter what I do, nobody can yank me out of that space. For some reason, I’ll always be representative of a certain brand of cinema, and no matter what I may have tried to achieve in the world of storytelling, I don't think that I've been able to shrug that off. The fact that we are a mainstream studio that has an officially selected film at Cannes, is no mean achievement but I’m never going to get the credit for that. They will still go on about Nadaaniyan. My love for Neeraj, respect for him and reverence for him is in abundance. But I've taken those chances previously also with stories and storytelling. Sadly I don't get that credit, and now I don't seek it anymore, because I'm just proud that I could be a part of Homebound. Had Neeraj not sent me the script of Homebound, and had he come to me with something else, I would have still been on board. I always believe in the filmmaker first, and like Neeraj very kindly put it, we have a mutual respect, love and admiration for each other as human beings. To me that is very important. I think I've always done my worst work with people who I don't like. If I don't like you, I don't think I can make a good film no matter how good the story or the screenplay. Somehow the personal touch, or rather, the personal connection that I have with the filmmaker shows up even on the final product. When I saw Homebound, I had a meltdown at the end, I was weeping, and he was looking at me thinking, that I'm going through some kind of cathartic reaction because the world of the film is far removed from the cinema I have directed, or many of the films I may have produced. But the emotions are universal, as is the connection of characters and their trials and tribulations. How can that not touch anyone? A Masaan can move me, as much as a huge mainstream commercial outing. Films and stories are universal. I relate to Neeraj, the filmmaker, the human being so much that I hope and pray that he never goes to any other producer.
What's so special about Homebound that you chose this to be your second film?
Neeraj: The best way to talk about the times that we live in is via friendship. It's a theme that is so universal, that cuts across so many boundaries and so many regions and geographies. And this story stirred something inside of me, all the things that I wanted to say. 65% of our economy is agrarian and rural. We have completely forgotten them in our cinema, we only cater to the 15% urban population, or now the small town is the new urban. I also wanted to come from a place of empathy, and didn’t want to deride anyone or put anyone down. Even with the people who may have transgressed. Can we recalibrate ourselves towards the greater good of humanity and have compassion for each other? I think Karan and my friendship also blossomed through this film. He had such amazing inputs. He read the screenplay twice, he had very genuine feedback and points to tell me.
Your thoughts on the screenplay Karan…
Karan: I've always been very deeply moved by tales of friendship, having been an only child, with no siblings and growing up with my own set of complexes, I really used to lean on my friends. I'm low on family, I don't have much family. When my dad passed away 20 years ago, my big support system came from my friends. They continue to be my support system. When I read Homebound, that was my take away from it. At the core of it, it's a friendship story. And within friendships there are insecurities, there are egos, there's also a sense of hidden competitiveness. Beyond all the layers and sublayers that Homebound has, and it has them in abundance, at its heart, it's a film about two friends, their ups and downs, their struggles, their trials, their tribulations, and eventually their last journey, which I don't want to say anything about and give you no spoilers. Even the film’s title has a deep rooted significance. It's much like an onion, every peel will make you discover something. If you watch it once, I don't think it'll be enough. I feel you need to watch it again, revisit it for you to really dive deep into the subtext. I think any great film has beautiful subtexts that are hidden away and tucked away by the filmmaker and the writers. The film will give you all that in abundance. I loved the screenplay. I was crying at the end of the film when I read it. I was crying at the end when I watched it. I think it's the greatness of a filmmaker that he or she is able to translate a beautiful piece of writing and take it to an altogether different level. I'm not sure I gave any great feedback points that really moved the needle in the film. I enjoyed it like a filmmaker would reading a great piece of writing. Demographically and geographically, the friendships portrayed by the two lead protagonists are in a totally different environment from the life that I have or the life that I've grown up in, but the points that the friendship talks about, I think, can hit home to anyone, no matter which country, no matter which culture. This was not a film for just the regional market, or for the local market. It's a film for the world.
It’s an indie-spirited film backed by a major Indian studio. That’s a new model away from the current focus on co-productions…
Neeraj: Co-production is a very long process, and you have to also involve the governments in co-productions across the countries. That is a longer cycle, and also there is a lot of pressure to make a certain kind of film. With Homebound I could deep dive exactly the way I wanted to. I didn’t have to adhere to a European ethos or idiom. Just because I'm going to Dharma, it’s not like I am making a 10 crore film for 45 crores. I can't be splurging. You have to make the model sustainable. This model is perfect for me. It helps me because I feel empowered.
Karan: I think some things, I think I just inherited from my dad. He always felt that if you make a film that is a massive success, and the people on that set were unhappy, then that's not a successful film. He used to say that a happy crew is a blockbuster film, and that somehow has percolated within the system. It's really my instinct on the filmmaker, or sometimes the material. When I heard the script of Kill, I knew it was not the quintessential mainstream film. It was action but what you can call independent action, because it was high concept, within a train, leaning on completely new actors, and with a Korean crew. We didn't know we were going to be selected at Toronto or win the Audience Award in its Midnight Madness section. Or that Lionsgate was going to pick it up. Can we do many of these? I'm not so sure. I'm not sure that I would replicate this model with anyone else. I think I would do this only with Neeraj at this point of time. Several films have come on our table. And it's not because I don't believe in stories, but because another company has invested money in us and we are accountable every quarter. But there are certain films that you want to make because you also want to garner respect, not just the money. If we make money on Homebound, trust me that's like a huge upside, but I'm doing this just for the love and respect and for pushing the boundaries of independent cinema within the mainstream arena. I'm not going to lie to you, I always seek validation and respect from the intellectual community, the critic community. I might try and pretend to be above it, but I'm not. I get so excited when a film of mine gets critical acclaim. I'm like a kid in a candy store when I wake up to amazing reviews. And that's rare at Dharma. It doesn't happen with every film. I do seek the validation of cinephile intellectual audiences across the world and definitely in my country.
And nothing can get bigger than a validation from Martin Scorsese! He has a credit in the film of Executive Producer…
Karan: I think I'm a little still in shock. I'm not exactly calibrating this reality. I'm not sure how to react, because I've been a huge Martin Scorsese fan across all his work. The fact that he has this mind, that he's so passionate, that his notes have been so incredible, that he watched the film, fine-combed it, gave Neeraj so many incredible points, the fact that I'm privy to that information, the fact that his name is on a film that has Dharma Productions name as well. It's like an out of body experience for me. I'd be full of large words of excitement, but they'll be just words. I'm not able to describe the feeling to you, and yes, it's been in talks for a while, until it came in black and white to us.
Neeraj: The involvement came in way before. More than a year back. I have the same disbelief that Karan has right now, it's still not sunk in. He's read the script three times and given me notes every time. He watched it three times once it got made. There were three, four people in the crew who knew about it, apart from the producers, of course. And the code word we'd use for him was “Bade Papa”. It was surreal to be on a Zoom call with him. He’s literally the biggest filmmaker right now. I don't know if I can ever be so benevolent and kind to someone.
Did you meet him?
Karan: I had the privilege of meeting him in Berlin. You know when he and Leo came to meet Shahrukh, when we were premiering My Name Is Khan in 2010 and he had come to meet Shahrukh, and I was in the room at that time. And they were showing Shutter Island in the same year. He sat for an hour, we chatted about so much, but I've never met him in the course of the Homebound journey. Neeraj has had the privilege of many zoom chats and interactions.
Bombay Talkies had been at Cannes. How often have you been there?
Karan: I had been the ambassador of a brand that took me there several times. In the official capacity, Bombay Talkies was the first time, but in a massively official capacity, with a film I have produced, it’s the first time. It’s my Cannes debut on the red carpet in many ways.
What makes Cannes so special?
Karan: It’s the holy grail of great cinema. It’s like the ISI mark of best world cinema. Neeraj called me, played cool and then took a beat and a pause and said we had made it and I screamed loudly. I haven’t screamed so loudly ever. I am not an effusive person, I don’t know how to show excitement. Shows how much of a big deal it is for filmmakers. I knew in my heart that we needed Cannes to kickstart the journey of Homebound.
How was it to work with the young Bollywood stars?
Neeraj: If I remade the film, I would cast them again. Once you see it, you’ll know what they have brought to the table. They came with 100% surrender. They brought kindness and dignity to the characters.