Joseph Mor Gregorios took over as the Catholicos of the Jacobite Syrian Christian Church on March 25, assuming the title of Catholicos Aboon Mor Baselios Joseph I. The 64-year-old prelate has come to the helm of the Jacobite Church at a time when it is facing many challenges, the toughest being the dispute with the Orthodox faction. In an interview with TNIE, he speaks about the challenges ahead and the Church’s legal battles.
Excerpts:
Can you tell us about your journey into priesthood?
It’s a long story (chuckles). It started when I was in eighth standard, around age 13. After my Hindi exam, I was walking home when a car stopped near me in Mulanthuruthy. Inside was Perumpally Thirumeni (Geevarghese Gregorios), who knew me as an altar boy. He asked me to get in and told me he wanted to make me a chamachan (deacon). I was thrilled.
Those days, priests were held in such high regard. He asked me to inform my parents, but they felt I was too young. However, Thirumeni was adamant. The very next day, we bought the necessary clothing, and quietly, without much announcement, I was ordained a deacon on March 25, 1974, at Manjinikkara.
How were your schooldays after that?
Honestly, it was tough. I had to wear the deacon’s dress to school. My classmates thought I was wearing a fancy dress costume! They made fun of me and I cried at first, but eventually, they understood. Later, at Maharaja’s College in Ernakulam, I faced similar teasing.
When did you become a priest?
In 1984, at the age of 23. At that point, I had to choose between being a married or celibate priest. I asked for time. Meanwhile, my family had almost finalised a marriage proposal. I struggled internally but remembered that Parumala Thirumeni had once wished my grandfather would become a celibate priest. Eventually, I prayed deeply and chose celibacy.
What followed after ordination?
My first posting was in Bengaluru, where I helped construct a church. Then I went to Ireland for postgraduate studies and managed a church in England. Later, I moved to the US for a doctorate. There, I trained as a hospital chaplain and worked in two government hospitals—one in New York and another in Bridgeport, Connecticut. It was during this period, in 1994, that I was called to become a bishop. Interestingly, every major step in my life has come at 10-year intervals.
You witnessed the disputes within the Church firsthand...
Absolutely. From a young age, I saw the chaos—police, arrests, lockups, and even injuries and deaths among the faithful. Those memories never leave you. The conflict may have changed form, but the pain and frustration remain.
Do you believe the recent Supreme Court judgment (that set aside a Kerala HC order directing the state to take possession of six churches of the Jacobite faction) is a relief?
Yes, to some extent. But the 2017 judgment and its strict enforcement were painful. It started with just one church in Kolenchery, yet the ruling ended up affecting over 1,200 churches. It deemed our administration “parallel”, ignoring the church’s split history. We lost historic churches — my own 150-year-old parish and places like Mulanthuruthy and Kadamattom. The denial of funeral services hit the faithful deeply.
How do you view the situation?
The churches belong to the believers. Clergy are spiritual guides. The Orthodox Church governance places all church properties under the Malankara metropolitan. Our belief, rooted in the Petrine tradition, aligns with the universal church.
Has the change in Supreme Court’s attitude helped?
We tried to highlight the 2017 verdict’s impact. Though only a larger bench can revise it, we explained the consequences using visuals and data. The court noted that worship under police protection isn’t ideal and asked the high court to handle the matter without bias. Legal disputes may continue, but the response was more empathetic.
What kind of settlement do you expect?
Peaceful coexistence is the only viable path. There was a split, a brief merger, and a separation again. Our hierarchical model follows the universal Church under the Patriarch, similar to the Catholic papacy. The Orthodox claim full independence and have affirmed this in court filings. Coexistence, like among the Catholic denominations in Kerala, is possible. They may acknowledge the Patriarch as a symbolic head — we’re open to that. Many from their side want peace. This conflict affects wider society, even drawing in non-Christians. Legal battles must end and we must act with Christian values. Dialogue is the way forward.
Devalokam (headquarters of the Orthodox faction) claims the Jacobite faction is splitting the Church...
History speaks for itself. The Orthodox Church emerged from a split. We’ve maintained the original faith. It’s inaccurate to blame us. After the 2017 verdict, the Patriarch initiated a conciliation committee. Had talks happened then, the situation could have improved. Instead, there were aggressive church takeovers.
The Orthodox faction says Indian clergy are treated as second-class citizens. Is that true?
Not true. We have autonomy except for the requirement of the Patriarch’s blessing for consecrations. No one has said Indians cannot become the Patriarch.
Burial disputes have caused pain. What has been done to address that?
It’s a deeply emotional issue. In one case, a family donated the body for medical studies due to denial of burial. The Kerala Christian Cemeteries Act (2020) helped manage this. We’ve established separate cemeteries in many regions. But setting up cemeteries requires multiple approvals. We’re also working on shared cellars.
In the 1980s, when there was a conflict between the two factions in north Kerala, they eventually reached a consensus, and peace returned. Can you elaborate?
Yes, it’s very peaceful there now. We often refer to it as the ‘Malabar Model’. The bishops from both factions took the lead in resolving the issues. As part of the agreement, we reached understandings at the level of individual churches—some churches were handed over to them, and in some cases, we built new churches with their cooperation. It was a good model of coexistence. Similar isolated efforts took place in the Kandanad and Kottayam dioceses as well. Even today, there’s still potential for such consensus if there’s a genuine will.
The Orthodox faction opposed the Kerala government’s decision to send a delegation to the ceremony in Lebanon where you took over...
The decision to send delegates was taken by both the central and state governments. It was a significant recognition for us. However, the Orthodox faction opposed it and even went to the high court. The fact that we received acknowledgment from the government, and that the judiciary supported it, seems to have deeply frustrated them. I’m not sure why they took that path. It feels like there was some external influence.
What do you want from the negotiations?
We don’t want anything that we don’t deserve. Even if the court says so. That’s my attitude. To make it clearer, I’d like to say that if the court gives me back my parish church, I’m ready to consider some claims of the people belonging to the Orthodox faction. Even if the court says otherwise. I believe laws are made for human beings, not the other way around. It has been proven that the Orthodox faction can never defeat us using faith as a weapon.
They need to accept our dignity. The terms they use to address us are demeaning. Though we aren’t bothered by that, sadly, it shows their culture. Even as they file new cases every other day, I hope one day they’ll realise that we are their brothers and peace will reign. Even many among them are praying for that day.
Do you think some people are trying to wipe out the Jacobite Church?
It can be seen from their actions that they don’t want the Jacobite Church to be considered at all. Not even as a parallel set-up, as deemed by the courts. They want the church to be confined to just a few Simhasana churches (churches that are directly under the ecclesiastical throne of the Patriarch of Antioch, rather than under a local diocesan bishop).
The situation today is such that the Orthodox faction can’t enter any of these disputed churches without police protection. But we can enter any of these churches, at any time and without any police protection. When the court orders came, our people had decided to barge into the churches and cemeteries as a group. However, we cautioned them against that. Even the Orthodox faction was afraid of something like that happening.
It is argued that the 2017 verdict happened because the Jacobite Church failed to make its arguments stick...
Many people do think that way. However, I won’t be able to say much as I wasn’t actively involved in the litigation.
The case itself was the result of thoughtless actions of some people. We had appointed top lawyers to fight the case.
However, in the earlier cases, orders based on the 1934 constitution became favourable to them. It reflected in the 2017 judgment too.
Do you see this conflict as a matter of faith or a dispute over properties?
Originally, this wasn’t a property dispute, though it has often been portrayed that way. The opposing faction has only become the custodian of church properties — not of the people. As a result, they are struggling to manage many churches and are now receiving funds from their headquarters to keep them running. For us, the issue is far more emotional than material.
Are there any issues now with churches being built by the Jacobite faction?
Each of our churches is now independent. We have moved away from the traditional congregation structure to avoid future legal complications. New churches are not directly registered under the Jacobite Church. Instead, parishioners form independent congregations, trusts, or societies, under which the properties are registered and buildings constructed. To prevent future legal troubles, bishops’ names are no longer used in land documents.
How many churches have been constructed so far?
We’ve built churches at 60 places, most of them are temporary structures.
What’s happening at the Thiruvarpu Church in Kottayam?
The Orthodox faction currently conducts Holy Mass there. They bring people from outside the parish, sometimes even arranging transportation. Only two or three Orthodox families reside in that parish.
There are around 300 Jacobite families in the area.
Have you lost institutions like schools or colleges?
Yes, especially during the early phase of the conflict. Some institutions under individual churches have also been affected. We have only one hospital in Kothamangalam, and if the dispute reaches that church, even that could be impacted.
Do you support the Church Act?
Absolutely. We believe the Church Act is a legitimate and just solution. The courts have acknowledged the need for such legislation. The draft is complete, and while the government is cautious about not appearing biased, we remain hopeful. We await its implementation with cautious optimism.
Some say Churches are moving closer to the BJP. What’s your take?
The BJP is trying to build better relations with Churches in Kerala. However, that doesn’t mean there’s any political alignment. Our concerns remain centred on justice and peaceful coexistence. Churches in Kerala maintain open channels with all political parties so that our concerns are heard.
What is the Jacobite Church’s stance on the Waqf Bill?
While I haven’t deeply studied the bill, our stand is rooted in justice. No community should be evicted unfairly and any law made should preserve communal harmony. We stand with those who face injustice.
Did the Union government respond to the Jacobite Church’s concerns?
While our issues were acknowledged during talks, there’s been no real follow-up. The state government has done more in terms of actively seeking solutions, including initiating the Church Bill. We’re open to further talks if the Centre re-engages.
How is your rapport with Chief Minister Pinarayi Vijayan?
We share a good relationship. The CM was close to the late Baselios Thomas I, and he has shown genuine concern for our plight. His government introduced the Cemetery Bill and the Church Bill, both of which stemmed from a desire to bring justice. We respect his commitment.
Have you raised these issues with the Prime Minister?
Yes. He told us that when he was the chief minister of Gujarat, there existed a similar dispute between two factions of the Muslim community. He initiated conciliatory talks between them several times, without much success. He told us that while he could find a way out in most issues that he intervened in, he couldn’t make much headway in this particular issue. It’s tough to find a common ground in disputes between two sections of the same religion, he told us. When we told him about the burial-related disputes, he was amazed such things happen in Kerala.
Has the infighting among Christian factions hurt the Church’s image?
Sadly, yes. It’s tarnished the respect we once held in society. The Christian community needs deep self-reflection. True evangelisation must begin within — by living Christian values rather than just performing rituals. Society, that once looked up to us, now only sees our divisions.
Do you feel today’s youth is drifting away from the Church?
A section of them, yes. Migration has contributed to this. But those who migrate are still forming congregations abroad, which is heartening. Social media and online worship post-Covid have changed the landscape. Although online services help the elderly, it does impact church attendance.
What challenges do you face now as the head of the Church?
I took up this role in a time of crisis. My priorities are to prevent the loss of any more churches, ensure justice through legal means, and stand for the welfare of the marginalised. I draw inspiration from Christ, who stood with the suffering. Like Mother Teresa said, it’s more important to be faithful than successful.
Has the loss of parishes caused financial strain?
Definitely. We don’t get foreign funding and depend entirely on public contributions. Legal cases are costly. We have very few institutions generating income. But I believe we’ll survive as long as people support us.
Is there still hope for peace talks?
We don’t rule it out. But discussions always get stuck at the 2017 Supreme Court order. Unless there’s a willingness to look beyond legalities, it’s difficult.
What’s your view on ‘love jihad’?
Personally, I don’t subscribe to that terminology. It carries a lot of baggage and often promotes unnecessary fear. That said, we cannot completely ignore certain incidents or concerns raised by families. Across the world, Christians face challenges — especially in places like Turkey, Iraq, and Syria. What used to be predominantly Christian regions have seen dramatic shifts. Migration and persecution have made the community vulnerable. Some believe Christians are seen as easy targets.
Do you support Churches taking political sides?
It’s natural for Churches to maintain ties with parties that support their causes. But I don’t believe Churches should form own political parties. While many Christians work across political lines — including in the BJP — our focus must be justice and peace, not politics.
Has the Christian community lost its influence on Congress politics?
Compared to 30 years ago, yes. We no longer have the same level of representation. Oommen Chandy was a charismatic leader, and after him, no one has matched that stature. Still, we have some representation and must continue working with all sides.
Has the Jacobite Church leant towards the Left because of the support received?
The Left has helped us — especially with the Cemetery and Church Bills. But we don’t align exclusively with any party. During Oommen Chandy’s government, he had tried to resolve the problems of the Church. Some from the Orthodox faction boycotted him for a long time. Our community includes people of all political ideologies.
The Jacobite Church introduced women in church administration recently. Can we expect women priests in the near future?
It isn’t easy to think about that in the current situation. Earlier, when we practised adult baptism and all, we had deaconesses. They had a lot of power. Those can be rethought through proper discussions. The Church has a custom of male domination. That is slightly changing now. Recently, a lady was chosen as the trustee of a church, which is a new thing. So, the 30% reservation for women in church administration is happening slowly, step by step. Churches changing is a good thing.
What is your Easter message?
Easter is the celebration of hope, peace, and resurrection. It reminds us that even in the darkest hour, truth will prevail. The journey towards peace is not easy — it is the path of the cross. It involves suffering, betrayal, and isolation. But the resurrection tells us that such pain is not the end. This is echoed in our Indian philosophy too—Satyameva Jayate. I urge everyone, both within and outside our community, to embrace peace, tolerance, and truth.
Any message specifically for the Orthodox church?
The Jacobite Church is always ready to discuss matters and find an appropriate solution. There have been wounds, some really deep. Still, as a Christian community, we should forgive each other. They are the ones who can contribute to this the most as they are currently in a ‘legally’ win-win situation. It’s their parent organisation, even if they don’t accept it. We are ready for all talks but the Church’s essence shouldn’t be stained. My responsibility is to protect that.
TNIE team: Kiran Prakash, Rajesh Abraham, Sasidharan Nair M K, Rajesh Ravi, Manoj Viswanathan, Anu Kuruvilla. A Sanesh (photos), Pranav V P (video)